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Citizen и другие японские часы

Форум о часах Citizen.
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  #31  
Старый 21.02.2010, 16:36
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Вот нарезал по истории кому лень поиском искать:
It appears that, to understand the origins of Ricoh as a watch manufacturer, you must be familiar with both the founder, Kiyoshi Ichimura [or Itimura, in fact, BOTH spellings are used even in the same translation!], and a company called Takano Co., Ltd.

Takano was in existence as a watch company (or brand, really) only 4 years and 11 months. It's root, according to the Hokkaido Watch Museum was a "High field metallic goods factory" ["high field" seems to be alternatively translated as "industrial"] established to manufacture metallic clocks such as alarm clocks in a "High field (or "Industrial") clock factory" established for the "multiplication clock manufacturing" [mass production of clocks?] in 1899 (and 1913, but no explanation is given of the 2nd year). They amalgamated in 1921 becoming a "High field (Industrial) clock metallic goods factory". Then, the metal goods section was split off April 23, 1938. The Ricoh Fact Book 2006 says "Apr. 1938 - Founded Takano Seimitsu Kogyo Co.,Ltd."

It must be noted that the word "clock" seems to be used often as the translation for "watch", so it's possible that they are really talking about watches, or possibly BOTH clocks and watches, here.

Takano was also involved in the production of weaponry from 1938 through and after the end of the Korean War (until 1956).

Movements for men's and women's watches are purchased from the "[rako-]" {also written there as "RAKO"} (maybe they mean Rado??) Co. in West Germany, to make the best use of equipment for producing munitions (after Korean War ends), and production [though maybe they mean, "development" and/or "pre-production"?] of wristwatches begins in February, 1957. [Ed Note: If anyone does know what this "RAKO" Co. is, feel free to chime in. I'll continue searching & will update w/ the correct name if I find it] UPDATE: I believe the correct answer is "Laco"!! It is German & linguistically makes sense as pronunciation of "L" becomes "R"-like with the Japanese!

In July, 1957, a technical tie-up was accomplished with Hamilton Clock of the United States .

"The wristwatch No.1" of Takano Co., Ltd. (so-called [rako-], maybe "Laco" type) and "2000 series" are put on the market on September 10, 1957.

In October, 1959 & afterwards, a thin hand wind watch, thinnest in the world (this is implied in the Hokkaido text), "Chateau", is put on sale. The technology was shown around the world. However, Takano suffered damage of 110 million yen & a one month shutdown of the factory from the Ise bay typhoon in September, 1959. In addition, the achievement [Chateau] suffers due to the immaturity of the sales force. The Chateau used an increased diameter [I interpret the text to mean an increase from 10.5 to 11.5 (lignes) in the Chateau], but thinner, movement from the older models. In a discussion with the Technical Director of Ricoh Watch [see below under Ricoh history section], it is said that the intent of that decision was to improve the "maintenance accuracy" of the movement. Observation of examples of these posted on the net show the dial to be simply labeled as "Chateau" without the "Takano" name (but with an applied logo), but the caseback is labeled as "Takano Precision" which is used as the brand on the dials of other models. Note that the movement inside of the Chateau has a different architecture than the Precision. See links provided below for examples on the net at the time of writing of this article.

Takano faces the threat of bankruptcy around the summer of 1961.


Mr. Kiyoshi Ichimura (or Itimura) is shown as having a growing career within this company, as well as having various business leadership roles outside Ricoh. From the Fact Book,

Feb. 2, 1936 Kiyoshi Ichimura appointed executive managing director (until Jan. 11, 1946)

Jan. 12, 1946 Kiyoshi Ichimura appointed president (until Dec. 16, 1968)
Per Hokkaido, he died November 17, 2004 of chronic hepatitis, but per the 2006 Fact Book: "Dec. 16, 1968 Founder and President Kiyoshi Ichimura passed away" I'm inclined to believe the official Ricoh document on this one!!
As you may remember from the Takano history above, a "tie-up" with Hamilton was entered in 1957. Further development of this "tie-up" resulted in a joint venture between Hamilton and the Takano successor (Ricoh).

From Wikipedia, Hamilton history shows:

"In 1962, Hamilton entered into a joint venture (60% owned by Hamilton) with the Japanese watchmaking firm Ricoh to produce electric watches meant primarily for the Japanese market. The electronic components were produced at Hamilton's Lancaster factory while production of the mechanical works and final assembly was undertaken in Japan. Although production levels of Hamilton-Ricoh watches was high (over 1000 per month), demand was low and consequently, the Hamilton-Ricoh partnership was unable to compete with the substantial market presence of Seiko. The partnership was dissolved in 1965, with the remaining Hamilton-Ricoh electronic movements (marked 'Ricoh 555E') re-cased as 'Vantage' and sold in the US."
which in turn says:
"The Hamilton Ricoh Watch Company, Ltd. was a joint venture (60% owned by Hamilton) and only existed between 1962 and 1964. Electric parts were made in Lancaster, PA while the mechanical parts were made in Japan, the watches also being assembled in Japan. The movements are marked "Ricoh 555E", but are the same as the Standard Time Corp. 130E (fitted in Hamilton's Vantage range), which in turn is very similar to the Hamilton 505.

Although the factory was turning out 1000 / month, very few were sold. Marketing was handled by Ricoh but they failed to break the stranglehold and monopoly that Seiko had in the Japanese stores; in the end, most were sold on US military bases in Japan.

The partnership was dissolved in 1965; some of the Hamilton Ricoh movements were re-cased as Vantage and sold in the US."
Going back to Ricoh mechanical watches: Quoting an interview with "Sue Kazumi", also called "Harmony Sea" or "end of the sea" or "Japanese Sea" in their essay (I assume they translated the man's name into English different ways), who became the Technical Director of Ricoh Watch, they go on to say:

Offending Paragraph (below) - as edited...

They started designing a watch equipped an automatic winding mechanism and a calendar which was named, "Dynamic auto", and put on the market from the Ricoh brand as a 33 jewel luxury model in October, 1962. The president, Kiyoshi Ichimura, of Ricoh Watch seems to have hastened the introduction of this model. Further in one translation, Hokkaido Museum says: "Just like R*lex Date-just, Day-24 incorporates a mechanism to change the day and date at the moment." I interpret that to mean that the "Dynamic" refers to instantanous day/date rollover or to a quick-set feature also found in the R*lex Date-just. Ed Note: Anyone here got a Date-just from that period?? Maybe we could confirm what they really mean!

Now, the above paragraph, excerpted from the Hokkaido Museum seems to leave something out in it's explanation. I have pictures of a 33 jewel model called/labeled "Autojust" which is DATE ONLY. Further, I have pictures of a 30 jewel model labeled as "Dynamic Auto" which DOES have both Day & Date - a crown at 3 o'clock AND a pusher @ 2 o'clock, making it look a bit like a Seiko 7619 or a Seiko Bellmatic 4006. I also have pictures of one with a "mod" holographic dial with the same crown & pusher set-up, though I cannot see enough dial text to say if it's labeled "Dynamic" or what the jewel count is. So... there may indeed be a little bit more to the history of Ricoh automatic watch development than Hokkaido is letting on!

However, following paragraphs @ Hokkaido discuss trouble with the original Dynamic day/date setting or advancement mechanism, saying "it became the mountain of returned goods soon." A new design was put on the market as "Dynamic Wide" on February 14, 1966, and as they note: "This move[ment] became a long seller, and seems to have been installed in the automatic [wind watch] until at least the 1990's for [export]." Ed. Note: Words in square brackets are mine, replacing the original translation, & intended to clean up the English for better readability.
Going back to electronic watches, Seiko announces & puts on the market at the same time, the world's first quartz wristwatch (Astron) on December 25, 1969. On the other hand, Ricoh announces, and puts the world first quartz wristwatch with date and day of the week on the market in July, 1971. OK - well, at least I think that's what they were saying about Ricoh. The actual translation was:

"On the other hand, Ricoh announces, and puts the quartz wristwatch with the date and a day of the week of the world first on the market in December of the same year in July, 1971. It became a manufacturer that manufactured and had put the quartz wristwatch on the market from Seiko secondarily in Japan in the delay for two years by an electronic technology that cultivated it with office automation apparatuses of the camera and the copy, etc." Or, in an alternative translation, "The Ricoh 1971 is July's quartz wristwatch with day date, the world's first 12 releases in the same year." Arrgh!!

Again, with regard to mechanical models, Ricoh did have additional models and the museum indicates Ricoh was a watch manufacturer for 40+ years! I have seen Ricoh's labeled:

1. World Time with 2 under-the-glass world time tracks [outer one has 24 hour divisions, inner has cities of the world], a world map in the dial center, & 2 crowns [one apparently turning the 24 hour ring]. It also has day & date at 6 o'clock!

2. World Time Oceana with an external bezel containing cities of the world, and an outer track on the dial with 24 divisions. It has a crown @ 3 o'clock and day/date display there as well, and is an automatic. I believe the movement is 17 jewels.

3. World Time Diver automatic with day/date and crown @ 3 o'clock and an external turning bezel with cities of the world. The outer dial track lists hours from 13 to 24. The jewel count is rather "fuzzy" in the pic, but may be 33, and if not, it could be in the 20s.

So, Ricoh did seem to produce a wide variety of "complications" in addition to standard "dress" watches!

I'll end the Ricoh history here, since this article is getting much longer than I anticipated - and because sources are drying up I'll try to do more research & continue the Ricoh history from the early '70s to it's end at a later date.
http://pinoyhorology.phpbb24.com/boa...t-i-t1063.html
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Эти 4 пользователей сказали Спасибо! scripach за это сообщение:
FrankCostello (02.10.2016), gon1969 (26.02.2020), GRANDX (01.08.2020), tchukovski (28.08.2020)
  #32  
Старый 21.02.2010, 18:58
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2scripach. Спасибо... Но если бы Вы читали правила, нам бы сейчас было легче читать историю
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  #33  
Старый 21.02.2010, 23:26
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Сообщение от Kowalski86 Посмотреть сообщение
У меня вот такой Ricoh имеется. Стали недавно, хотел понести в ремонт отремонтировать, смазать, сказали не тратить деньги. Привезли из Японии другу моего отца в конце 80-х, он часы не особо носил ну и подарил отцу, потом мне достались. В принципе часики убитые уже, носить врядли буду, не знаю что с ними делать... Сколько могут такие стоить? Извините за оффтоп
А сколько ты реально хочешь за нерабочие часы?
На запчасти мож возьму, ЦЕНУ ПЛИЗ В ЛИЧКУ!

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Маловероятно найти именно эти. Производитель давно почил. Я так понял особой надёжностью часы не отличались, хотя были и не плохо сделаны. А с какой целью Вы хотите найти именно их-прицениться? Если да то цена примерно 30-100$ в зависимости от состояния.
Нет Амет, у меня уже стоял принцип просто найти человека который владеет(или продаёт) именно такие как у меня! А почему принцип, да всё просто, дело в том, что вообще не видел нигде таких, не на Японских сайтах не на Китайских, нигде их нет! Вот по этому спросил.
Но всё равно большое спасибо за информацию!

Ах да, чуть не забыл!
Люди подскажите, где можно достать оригинальное стекло на них?
Пример стекла я выкладываю на фото(такое как на этих часах)!!!

Вот тут по чётче видны грани этого стекла!
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Этот пользователь сказал Спасибо! Paul Ulman за это сообщение:
Abu Danil (13.06.2013)
  #34  
Старый 22.02.2010, 12:32
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вот похожее стекло:
http://www.seiyajapan.com/product/S-...&wrapper=plain
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Этот пользователь сказал Спасибо! Happy за это сообщение:
Paul Ulman (22.02.2010)
  #35  
Старый 22.02.2010, 20:34
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Сообщение от Happy Посмотреть сообщение
вот похожее стекло:
http://www.seiyajapan.com/product/S-...&wrapper=plain
Спасибо Большое!
Да только вот теперь попробуй найти такое стекло в Днепропетровске(Украина)!
Вообщем буду искать!
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  #36  
Старый 22.02.2010, 21:06
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Спасибо Большое!
Да только вот теперь попробуй найти такое стекло в Днепропетровске(Украина)!
Вообщем буду искать!
в принципе, самый дорогой вариант - 528$+перекидка стекла на ваши
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  #37  
Старый 23.02.2010, 12:10
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самый дорогой вариант - 528$
???????????
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  #38  
Старый 26.02.2010, 13:40
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Помогите

Люди подскажите плиз, можно ли подрегулировать точность хода с помощью пружинки? Ибо я в этом не очень понимаю. И что обозначает этот плюс и минус?
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  #39  
Старый 26.02.2010, 18:12
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UP!!!!
Люди АУ!
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  #40  
Старый 28.02.2010, 23:00
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ну куда все пропали?
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Ответ
Метки
ricoh, rikoh


Быстрый переход


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