Хочу приобрести первый набор часового инструмента, прошу совета

[makar]

Доброго времени суток. Извините, что вклиниваюсь к Вам в тему. Очень хочется узнать, где в Украине можно купить часовой инструмент, о котором вы говорите в этой теме?
Или если здесь у нас это сделать нельзя, может найдется добрый человек, который купит то что мне нужно в Москве и за определенную плату переправит на Днепропетровск.

[Augusta]

Вы сами можете выбрать и заказать в Интернет-магазине http://www.****************/

[aruy]

Сообщение от Душан Груји~

В
Чтобы проиллюстрировать мою аргументацию, посмотрите на ссылку внизу.
http://www.epilamisierung.com/Epilam...isch/index.htm

Душан, не могли бы вы поделится вашим способом очистки механизма (наручные часы). Интересует прежде всего проблема распространения (растекания) масла?

[Душан Грујић]

Сообщение от aruy

...не могли бы вы поделится вашим способом очистки механизма (наручные часы). Интересует прежде всего проблема распространения (растекания) масла?

Добрый вечер Aruy,

Если это возможно я бы рад что я будем сделать это по английски, по меня это очень легче сделать так.

В любую случаю я буду сделать описание того, как я делаем очистки от наручные либо карманные часы, этот процесс является одинаковым, потому что проблема та же.

С уважением

Душан

[aruy]

Сообщение от Душан Груји~

Если это возможно я бы рад что я будем сделать это по английски, по меня это очень легче сделать так.

ОК, жду...

[Душан Грујић]

Сообщение от aruy

ОК, жду...

Добрый вечер,

Я надеюсь, что ожидание не было слишком долго. Ввод всего, следующее, на русском языке, потребовалось бы мне весь день.

Я искренне надеюсь, что я не разорвать любые правила форума, с полным текстом на Английском языке.

Возможно, один из модераторов будет перемещаться данное сообщение в новую тему, я считаю, что это должно быть обработать таким образом.

Если есть какие-нибудь вопросы, пожалуйста, идти вперед и попросить.

С уважением

Душан

Good evening to all,

I use two machines for watch cleaning and both are ELMA Super Elite, manually operated. I do not use ultrasonic machines for watch cleaning. I use Isopropyl alcohol as rinse #1 and #2 in both of my machines, in one I use Elma 1:9 ammonia based concentrate and in the other I use ELMA WF, the water free cleaning fluid. The change of cleaning fluid happens at about five to ten day intervals depending on the amount of work done even if very little work has been done the change takes place after about ten days at the most, particularly the ammonia based one. The rinse fluids, Isopropyl alcohol, gets changed as soon as I see that it is getting darker colour tinge to it, the first rinse goes out and the second takes its place where a second gets new fluid.

I have never given up practice of pegging jewels and other pivot holes as there always seem to be some encrusted oil or other dirt left that machine cleaning cannot remove, the pegging practice has been proven by measuring balance amplitude with and without pegging, and the length of time that the high amplitude is preserved. The peg wood is available at most of the supply houses.

I do not throw away used Isopropyl alcohol, I have a proper lab distilling apparatus so I recycle it. I also use distiller for making my own distilled water, the tap water being saturated with calcium salts and is useless for diluting the ammonia based cleaning concentrate, much better than using the car battery "distilled" water.

Isopropyl alcohol is widely used industrial cleaner that is available at most of the lab and other chemical supply companies. I get a lab variety labelled pro analysi meaning that it is very clean and with a minimum content of other matter hence about three times to four times more expensive than industrial. I get it at Ж 3.0 per litre in 1l lab type glass bottles or in 5 litre plastic containers at Ж 12.0 each. My choice of Isopropyl is based on it's physical properties, it is not nearly volatile as benzine or ethyl and methyl alcohols neither is it as toxic.

In some extreme cases when in problem of getting rid of especially gooey oil I use Benzinum Medicinale, a mixture of very light fractions of petroleum used by medical profession. It is VERY good solvent, I do avoid using it as it is highly volatile and is flammable. Also it is the best solvent and cleaner for Balance wheel and balance spring. (Do not confuse Benzine with Benzene. Benzine is a mixture of alkanes i.e. hexane, and heptane.) It comes in two grades with designations B65/105 and B35/75 with CAS No: 8032-32-4.

Isopropyl alcohol is a good solvent and it is very safe for shellac, it does not dissolve it in any serious measure to represent danger for watch parts held by shellac. In electronics industry Isopropyl alcohol is used as solvent after soft soldering for removing flux (resin) that is left by the process. Most component manufacturers test their components for resistance to Isopropyl alcohol to make sure that markings on components do not get removed in cleaning process. Often in data sheets of components one can find specification of time for safe exposure to Isopropyl alcohol. It is quite safe to use it to clean electronic watches including circuit boards and plastic parts as well. Some watch manufacturers recommend it as standard rinsing fluid, particularly for quartz watches, Seiko among others.

The Swiss cleaning machine the Greiner UU2 uses a distillation circuit to supply the rinsing chamber with freshly distilled Isopropyl alcohol. It is one of the best machines ever made for the repair workshop and it is a great shame that it is no longer available. During a visit to the Rolex service centre in Geneva, it was discovered that Rolex uses freshly distilled Isopropyl alcohol as a rinse as well.

One of the problems with Isopropyl alcohol rinsing is that the surfaces including jewels are usually so well degreased and chemically clean (with some exeptions), that oils have no chance of staying where they are supposed to be. It is required to give the components an Epilame treatment to prevent the spread. Several tests were done on identical watch components with a drop of 9010 applied, to establish how well the Epilame chamber on the Greiner machine worked. The results were quite convincing. After one week the untreated part had all the oil spread to a thin film, whereas the treated part had kept its drop of oil pretty much in its boundaries.

Epilame treatments of Antispread F2/50 FC60 or Fix-O-Drop are the repair shops alternative to the use of an Epilame chamber, and if applied right, should prevent the spread of oils for a long time. The balance however has to be omitted from treatment.

One commonly accepted method of using Epilame, which greatly lessens the evaporation rate, is to fit a fine mesh screen into the neck of the bottle. Most Epilame bottles have a sort of plastic stopper in the neck under the cap. One can cut the bottom portion from the stopper and fit a small piece of screen--perhaps a piece from an old cleaning basket.

Then the parts to be treated can be placed into the neck of the bottle, the cap tightly replaced and the bottle turned upside down on the bench for thirty seconds. Turn the bottle right side up, allow a few seconds for the liquid to drain back and remove the parts.

There are those who worry about contamination with this method, but the parts should be clean before they are placed into the solution. Any miniscule amount of contamination--is anything ever perfectly clean no matter how hard one might try?--will be greatly diluted by the relatively large amount of solution in the bottle.

Yes, the liquid does evaporate very quickly. One must always keep the bottle tightly capped. Using the above method, a 100 ml. bottle will last for months. In high humidity climates, the very rapid evaporation rate can cause moisture to form on the parts . It is recommend that one use a warm air dryer after taking the parts from the solution.

The use of Epilame is recommended to keep the oil in place on the pallet stones and the acting faces of the escape wheel teeth, as well as some auto-wind reversers. Treat a pallet fork and escape wheel with Epilame and then put them into the watch and allow it to run for a few minutes without lubrication. Generally the watch manufacturers designate the parts that must receive Epilame treatment, found within the Tech Guides for a given calibre.

The escape wheel will rub away the coating from the centre of the impulse face of the stones and from the escape wheel teeth. Then apply lubricant (Moebius 9415 or 941) to the face of the exit stone. This can be done with a fine oiler through the inspection holes in the main plate. Simply stop the balance wheel with the escape wheel tooth resting on the entrance stone and touch the oiler to the exit stone face. Do this two or three times with small amounts of oil letting the balance wheel turn for several teeth in between each application. Let the watch run for a few minutes to spread the oil.

Then let down the mainspring and remove the pallet fork. You will find a track of oil in the centre of the pallet stones, which is held in place by the surrounding Epilame coating. It does work, and it will greatly contribute to amplitude over a long period of time. Without the Epilame, the watch may run well at first, but in a few months the amplitude will fall off because the oil on the escapement has spread out across the escape wheel teeth and the pallet fork.

A. L. Breguet would have killed for this. "Give me a perfect oil..."

[Душан Грујић]

Добрый день, всем,

Чуть больше информации, от Британского Хорологического Института, в отношении спорного вопроса об использовании средства на удаление пятна с механизмов часов, в виде остатки смазочных средства и все что мы оставили с нашим пальцами.

Одним словом, они скажу, новый зло меньше, чем старо. Представление фактов, или только, рекламы для продажу?

Мой вопрос состоит в том: Если зло, вообще есть, приемлемо?



С уважением

Душан

[Nakim]

Извините что тему поднимаю,но по моему это актуально,т.к. и я и некоторые мои знакомые используют родико при очистке механизма. Я всегда прокатываю зубья в пасте,чтобы удалить пыль и остатки грязи,так же чищу камни и палеты,если это реально вредно есть ли какая нибудь другая альтернатива ? Возможная потеря амплитуды в 30 градусов шок для меня,это очень много если это на самом деле так! Не могу прочитать то что выложил Душан Грујић,т.к. у меня плохо с английским,расскажите кто нибудь в двух словах какая из тестируемых паст лучше или они все вредны ? Так же у меня есть советская паста с ПЧЗ,тоже зеленая (Мастика какая то),но тверже чем Bergeon (может от старости ?).
Спасибо большое за понимание!

[Победа]

раз тема всплыла покажу некий непрофильный "держатель".. он приподнимает объект и имеет возможности наклона плоскости, может натолкнуть нашего брата на изготовление чего то обладающего подобными свойствами.